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Post by Splinter on Oct 7, 2016 1:23:20 GMT -8
You can see town blarg contributing to the game, even admist his posting style. See: Harry Potter Blarg. When scum, Blarg usually turns lot more useless, and does not really contribute to the game much, unless under pressure of lynch. Hmm I thought there was a game that dispelled that theory, but now I cant think of it... Maybe I'm thinking of WWE? Damnit nin Edit: Election. I don't remember him being useful in election, lynched him in lylo. Even had the image based read list. |
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Post by Splinter on Oct 7, 2016 1:33:50 GMT -8
Oh man Fire and LP were around and choosing not to post? I fucking hate that kind of play so much. Going back to this LP has almost twice as many posts in scum chat as he does in the main thread. I know lurking is a legitimate (if bullshit) strategy, and I definitely don't want to discourage people posting in the scum thread, but I wonder if there's some way we can discourage this. Simple answer would be to require a main thread post within 30 minutes of every scum thread post, but I'm worried that will just result in less scum communication rather than less lurking. |
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Post by Splinter on Oct 7, 2016 1:40:11 GMT -8
Back in Danganronpa, kgtrep called me out for lurking the thread before my first post because you can see activity on GAF I guess. (He was right that I was being cautious as new scum). We don't allow that sort of play at the moment, but perhaps we should, only for call outs specifically related to checking the game thread.
People should be allowed to check gaf without feeling forced to catch up on the game, I don't want to overstep boundaries here. I just specifically want to address people that are reading the thread and choosing not to post.
(I did notice both LP and Fireblend online in Discord during day end, but this definitely shouldn't be allowed as a call out and even treating it as a scumtell would be stupid.)
Thoughts?
Or am I wrong in even trying to address lurkers? I just feel it makes the game less fun for the sake of improving your chances of winning, and we'd be better off if people did it less.
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Post by Splinter on Oct 7, 2016 1:44:00 GMT -8
(Sorry for the post spam) People should be allowed to check gaf without feeling forced to catch up on the game, I don't want to overstep boundaries here. I just specifically want to address people that are reading the thread and choosing not to post. Want to point out that reading the thread is playing the game, and choosing not to post is a game-related action. Town and scum do it at times for a range of reasons. I don't see it ever being an instant lynch or even a particularly strong scumtell, but someone caught doing it will end up having to justify themselves and that in turn generates discussion. Again this is all game-related, "I didn't have time to post" is a totally valid excuse as long as it's true. |
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Post by Ty4on on Oct 7, 2016 2:09:22 GMT -8
I really don't think think the problem is lurking, but rather low activity going by unnoticed. There's nothing stopping people from calling them out and asking for their opinion.
It's not scum's problem town can't find them, it's town's problem.
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Post by Splinter on Oct 7, 2016 2:17:13 GMT -8
Eh inactivity is another problem, I'm just talking about intentionally not posting. No way Fire and LP would have kept quiet in that situation if they were town.
It's also not just this game, it happens all the time. This was just a clearer example of it.
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Post by Ty4on on Oct 7, 2016 2:33:53 GMT -8
Eh inactivity is another problem, I'm just talking about intentionally not posting. No way Fire and LP would have kept quiet in that situation if they were town. It's also not just this game, it happens all the time. This was just a clearer example of it. No, no, I got that, but there's nothing stopping town from calling people out for their opinion when something happened or asking if they're there. www.mafiauniverse.com/forums/threads/3255-Season-3-Final-Game-The-Koopa-Troop?p=525447#post525447Another thing that happened a lot (which I couldn't search well for) was they would quote a post and then tag a bunch of names (to give them notifications) and ask for their opinion. |
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Post by cabot on Oct 7, 2016 2:47:08 GMT -8
Yeah I agree with Ty, this shouldn't be guidelined. It's on the players to call out the coasters.
It's a valid play.
Much like making up about 3 claims is, right lover?
Different strokes for different folks.
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Post by Splinter on Oct 7, 2016 2:56:45 GMT -8
It's a valid play, I'm not trying to outlaw it. I just think if we were allowed to look at activity then scum would think twice about not posting. Kgtrep's callout felt fair to me.
But maybe your right, maybe just asking them if they're around is enough. Feels like leaning on the honour system more than we need to.
Basically I'm trying to say it's valid but, especially for lower activity players, too effective at the moment. This was just an idea to weaken it.
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Post by OceanicAir on Oct 7, 2016 7:57:03 GMT -8
Eh, as I said in the PiR game it's fair play, as long as you aren't lying about your activity, it's all good. I don't really care if people don't post or not (unless you are town), people's lack of posting definitely played a part in who I thought was scum towards the end of the game since some people changed their posting frequency. I see no reason why you should force scum to post more since in all likelihood be detrimental to their game.
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Post by Blargonaut on Oct 7, 2016 10:38:14 GMT -8
 Maybe I'm thinking of WWE? Damnit nin Edit: Election. I don't remember him being useful in election, lynched him in lylo. Even had the image based read list. , *Sp, FYI, my excuse is that I seem to recall I was quite a late-game replacement in Election In fact, before I was overthrown in Election, I recall I was quite close to rallying Town near the end of that game; a certain military strat cat .GIF springs to mind Lost? yeah Useful? totesanyway, in the end I lost that game simply because I didn't have the same S-rank Rapport with you in Election, as we did here in Pokemon (which was what allowed me to so effortlessly Reichenbach Falls your Pokehind here, btw) |
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Post by Splinter on Oct 7, 2016 10:52:29 GMT -8
LA LA LA I CANT HEAR YOU
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Post by Blargonaut on Oct 7, 2016 10:55:41 GMT -8
hmm
I dunno, personally I don't see any viable way to curb lurking play without resorting to rather draconian oversight
or rather draconian custom game mechanics
I'll think of something
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Post by Blargonaut on Oct 7, 2016 10:57:31 GMT -8
Burb's about to announce that scum totally won  can't wait |
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Post by verelios on Oct 7, 2016 12:29:07 GMT -8
Wow, and I somehow completely gut scum read Sawneeks but felt it would never go over since town would never bite. MVP for sure.
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Post by Lone_Prodigy on Oct 7, 2016 13:49:29 GMT -8
Well it makes sense that I would have more posts in the scum chat than the game thread because scum chat continues at night.
As for Discord, I'm almost always logged in since I have it running in the background. So I wouldn't say that's an indicator of activity.
Activity being an issue is, I think, not a new concern. I remember previous seasons were trying to find a balance between high- and low-activity posters. So while this game may have been more inactive than most, I wouldn't say it's a new trend.
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Post by melonrabbit on Oct 7, 2016 14:10:27 GMT -8
Yeah. I'm pretty sure the doctor understands what their position now is, so I don't expect any night actions from them (or scum) for a while. Scum definitely wants to avoid Werewolf 2 situation, it would be quite easy to figure out 1-2 scum from yesterday, since no scum would want to hammer. Yeah. About that.... |
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Post by Splinter on Oct 7, 2016 14:40:31 GMT -8
I don't think this game was inactive.
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Post by cabot on Oct 7, 2016 23:51:14 GMT -8
you tried, melon.
Together, we'll save no one.
#BestDoctors2016
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Post by Roytheone on Oct 8, 2016 1:43:03 GMT -8
It's a valid play, I'm not trying to outlaw it. I just think if we were allowed to look at activity then scum would think twice about not posting. Kgtrep's callout felt fair to me. But maybe your right, maybe just asking them if they're around is enough. Feels like leaning on the honour system more than we need to. Basically I'm trying to say it's valid but, especially for lower activity players, too effective at the moment. This was just an idea to weaken it. I think we should be EXTREMELY careful with this. In the end, people play this for fun. If checking activity is allowed/ being forced to post etc. become rules, then that fun would very quickly disappear and the game would feel more like a job then actually a fun activity for me. We should never want that. The 30 minute idea for example would create the situation where if the game thread is very inactive, scum can't actually talk in their scum chat since being forced to post in the main thread will probably be obviously forced and look super scummy. |
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Post by Splinter on Oct 8, 2016 7:20:25 GMT -8
It's a valid play, I'm not trying to outlaw it. I just think if we were allowed to look at activity then scum would think twice about not posting. Kgtrep's callout felt fair to me. But maybe your right, maybe just asking them if they're around is enough. Feels like leaning on the honour system more than we need to. Basically I'm trying to say it's valid but, especially for lower activity players, too effective at the moment. This was just an idea to weaken it. I think we should be EXTREMELY careful with this. In the end, people play this for fun. If checking activity is allowed/ being forced to post etc. become rules, then that fun would very quickly disappear and the game would feel more like a job then actually a fun activity for me. We should never want that. The 30 minute idea for example would create the situation where if the game thread is very inactive, scum can't actually talk in their scum chat since being forced to post in the main thread will probably be obviously forced and look super scummy. I agree we should never try to force activity, I'm not trying to increase activity at all. I was talking specifically about situations were people are "playing" (reading, posting in scum chat), but strategically choosing not to post. I just think that strategy should carry a slightly* higher risk than it currently does. *and it is only slightly, the chances of actually being caught like this are very low, and even then it shouldn't be that hard to justify yourself. And yeah the 30 minute thing isn't ideal either. |
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Post by Splinter on Oct 8, 2016 7:24:22 GMT -8
For example, I called LP out for not reacting to Blarg's claim initially. He justified it by saying the claim was too stupid to take seriously, which got him off the hook but also locked him into a stance earlier than he might have liked. It's a good trade off, and it wouldn't have happened if he hasn't posted right after Blarg's claim.
(I see this idea isn't popular but I figured it's worth discussing at least)
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Post by melonrabbit on Oct 8, 2016 9:38:47 GMT -8
you tried, melon. Together, we'll save no one. #BestDoctors2016 Thanks. Always next time I guess lol |
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Post by Lone_Prodigy on Oct 11, 2016 10:19:19 GMT -8
For example, I called LP out for not reacting to Blarg's claim initially. He justified it by saying the claim was too stupid to take seriously, which got him off the hook but also locked him into a stance earlier than he might have liked. It's a good trade off, and it wouldn't have happened if he hasn't posted right after Blarg's claim. (I see this idea isn't popular but I figured it's worth discussing at least) I think this is fair, but it could also have been a case of me posting and not seeing Blarg claiming beforehand (lots of people reply and then exit the thread without reading further). I don't know if timing is really something you can focus on, outside of day end. In this case I was arguing in scum chat against Blarg claiming investigator so I was genuinely surprised at the claim but wasn't sure if that was "I'm town and wtf is this" surprise or "I'm scum and I hate that you didn't listen to me" surprise. So I needed time to process that.  |
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