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Post by Sorian on Jan 12, 2016 4:54:20 GMT -8
I think you're scum because of the inconsistencies of how you've presented yourself and your stance of scum hunting second, convenient lynches first. It's not so much that you guessed at mechanics. It's that it seems like your goal was to pass yourself off as a newbie but you had the opinions of a vet. Something didn't add up. lol, in what way were you a convenient lynch? As for scum hunting, there's nothing but blind luck or meta knowledge for Day 1. I don't control the former and lack some of the latter. All scum hunting did was get 9 people killed super early. I'm no longer interested in lynching you at all, but it seems cut and dry that losing you yesterday probably would have been better than losing Zip, all things considered. Hindsight is a bitch though, and I don't particularly blame any of the Zipped voters. He kinda dug his own grave. Lynching for information is convenient. In your own words, your main reason for calling for my lynch was information, that is convenient. Scum hunting came second, even saying I was scum (because you did eventually get around to saying 75% info/25% chance of scum) came as an afterthought and it almost sounded like you were trying to justify it to a crowd later. Trigger is pressure voting but that's about what I expect from her right now so let's drop the act. VOTE: RidliI'm not fooled. LoC is a confirmed townie and had painted himself an easy target. our best bet would be to find the people suspicious of LoC and lynch one. on a quick vote look-over, we have squidyj, scrafty, and mazre. out of the 3, squidyj and scrafty act the scummiest. this isn't taking into account people who were verbally suspicious of him yet didn't vote, which are actually in a higher tier of scumminess because they'd have known LoC was town. i don't have the time to find out who those people were, so for now: VOTE: Squidyj If you want my opinion, I think the people who were verbally suspicious but never put ties to him would be a better place to look. Squidy does still bother me a bit so you aren't all wrong but LoC was straight baiting everyone. I don't think scum would have fallen for the bait because they didn't have much to gain. With such a big game, bait like that was going to get picked up, they didn't need to worry about it. |
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Post by Kawl on Jan 12, 2016 5:23:43 GMT -8
Except for the fact that your supposed 'analysis' also lumped in all the pre-game chatter. Slapping a one line disclaimer and then blowing down a wall of text based on incomplete, inaccurate, and arbitrarily time gated information doesn't serve the interest of having a proper discussion. Also I somehow ended up in your reads despite having neither general suspicion or being an outlier in your data set. Was that purely 'omgus' for calling out your post? Oh no, sorry for not manually removing the first few pages before game start from the posts total. The only people or would significantly impact are those who had the bulk of their posts during that time, which means they are super low activity, which wasn't the grouping I was focusing most of that analysis on any how. And if anything your complaint would be overly complete/inclusive data not incomplete. And it was arbitrarily time gated in so far as I can only look up until that point in time, sorry I wasn't able to cast into the future to day's end and discuss that activity. But you're right I guess it would have been better to just let people continue with their completely arbitrary gut feels on whether people had been big providers of activity and thought. And yep, you fell on the end of the group of 5 who were clustered with 'enough' posts to perhaps be considered coasting scum. That was 15, 16, 16, 18, and 19 posts respectively iirc. No OMGUS involved there, just the numbers and graphs man. |
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Post by Kawl on Jan 12, 2016 5:27:47 GMT -8
Sure, that's what are saying now. But it's clearly not what you were saying originally. And being wrong isn't exactly a sign of being scum. Hell, I'd be more willing to buy that Scrafty was scum for pushing to get LoC lynched because it seemed like he was breadcrumbing to a lost partner, which could be a threat to other scum factions, neutrals, etc. If the game is actually splintered up into different scum factions as Sorian has said, scum actually won't know for sure who are town. They'll just know who ain't them. -I cannot take back what i said, it was clearly a mistake on my part for not even noticing that Zipped was voted off the island. I made the error and i stand by it, Sorry. I know this will again shed some bad light on me and i know that some players find my postings to be some kind of irritating but le me be clear that my vote for scrafty is legit since her trying to vote off LoC tilted some signs in my head in the last day aswell. -I know that being wrong is not actually a sign of being scum it just shows that that player ( in this case me ) is not even playing attention to the game and for that i apologize. - Regarding different factions being ingame. I think since we were almost 30 players i think it is safe to say that this is the case, something like in the Cthulu game were it was town against 2 scum factions. Since this game was put in the end of Season 4 and since Season 5 is almost ready to go it is safe to say that there can 2 players dying each night ( or even more like we saw tonight ) Meh, I'll park my vote here for now until I can do some thread reviewing. Vote: nin1000 |
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Post by cabot on Jan 12, 2016 5:37:57 GMT -8
I don't know nin, going hard on people thinking LoC was suspicious then he subsequently flips town isn't particularly strong. I mean he was revealed to be full of shit during D1.
He seemed to be playing in the same style as vigi factions where it was all charisma and no truth and lo and behold, my suspicion was correct. He lied and lied some more.
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Post by cabot on Jan 12, 2016 5:47:14 GMT -8
Except for the fact that your supposed 'analysis' also lumped in all the pre-game chatter. Slapping a one line disclaimer and then blowing down a wall of text based on incomplete, inaccurate, and arbitrarily time gated information doesn't serve the interest of having a proper discussion. Also I somehow ended up in your reads despite having neither general suspicion or being an outlier in your data set. Was that purely 'omgus' for calling out your post? Oh no, sorry for not manually removing the first few pages before game start from the posts total. The only people or would significantly impact are those who had the bulk of their posts during that time, which means they are super low activity, which wasn't the grouping I was focusing most of that analysis on any how. And if anything your complaint would be overly complete/inclusive data not incomplete. And it was arbitrarily time gated in so far as I can only look up until that point in time, sorry I wasn't able to cast into the future to day's end and discuss that activity. But you're right I guess it would have been better to just let people continue with their completely arbitrary gut feels on whether people had been big providers of activity and thought. And yep, you fell on the end of the group of 5 who were clustered with 'enough' posts to perhaps be considered coasting scum. That was 15, 16, 16, 18, and 19 posts respectively iirc. No OMGUS involved there, just the numbers and graphs man. You're making it sound like we're all clueless and saying these root feels with no basis in real numbers. I definitely look back at post counts, in the case of low posters I compare the posts against the game start timestamp, and I use the search by thread creator function to filter out everyones posts on a user basis. As far as I'm concerned any decent player should be doing this at some level as a fundamental part of their play. I don't agree that you raising it in the game is useful. This reaction in general seems kind of strong, which could be explained by 1) You're genuinely annoyed by people mocking something that took a bit of time and detail 2) You're defending your contributions to this thread where others are challenging it, making you a possible lynch target. I'd be willing to see you flip if the winds were blowing that way, but you're not my main target. It's still terra because he's hit that sweet spot of scumminess and uselessness, much like Zipped. Lava doesn't strike twice, right? |
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Post by Kawl on Jan 12, 2016 5:57:59 GMT -8
31 players, of varying effort and involvement, I don't think it's absurd to assume that not everyone is meeting your definition of a "decent" player, which also doesn't include those who posts mainly on mobile where search functions etc are pretty limited.
But meh, alright. I am hungover and grouchy, and trying to avoid work by being more active in this game. And of course you always annoy me Cabot.
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Post by Sorian on Jan 12, 2016 8:22:34 GMT -8
With 20 people, I'm surprised at how long this has been sitting silent.
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Post by Kawl on Jan 12, 2016 8:25:50 GMT -8
It was actually a group test of your restraint. Almost 3 and a half hours, we are all very proud of you Sorian!
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Post by Sorian on Jan 12, 2016 8:28:13 GMT -8
It was actually a group test of your restraint. Almost 3 and a half hours, we are all very proud of you Sorian! I've only been at work for about an hour, the rest of that 2.5 hours was getting ready, morning work out, eating, shower, and driving so not much restraint  |
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Post by Coppanuva on Jan 12, 2016 8:40:01 GMT -8
Where is Darryl, is he just going to sit on his Nin vote all day? LoC is a confirmed townie and had painted himself an easy target. our best bet would be to find the people suspicious of LoC and lynch one. on a quick vote look-over, we have squidyj, scrafty, and mazre. out of the 3, squidyj and scrafty act the scummiest. this isn't taking into account people who were verbally suspicious of him yet didn't vote, which are actually in a higher tier of scumminess because they'd have known LoC was town. i don't have the time to find out who those people were, so for now: VOTE: SquidyjI'm willing to consider this logic for now, given the lack of other information. There's been a recent surge in votes on Terra from people (at time of writing Splinter hasn't updated but it looks like he's at 3), with the main reason being that he's not been playing usefully and he's been somewhat scummy (basically putting him in the same position as Zipped yesterday). Personally, I'm not ready to lynch Terra yet given that he hasn't said anything of note this day. What's your feeling right now on lynching someone from your LoC grouping vs lynching someone outside of it who's acting weird? It was actually a group test of your restraint. Almost 3 and a half hours, we are all very proud of you Sorian! I've only been at work for about an hour, the rest of that 2.5 hours was getting ready, morning work out, eating, shower, and driving so not much restraint People here post while in traffic all the time. You're slipping #FallFromGrace |
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Post by Sorian on Jan 12, 2016 8:47:21 GMT -8
LoC is a confirmed townie and had painted himself an easy target. our best bet would be to find the people suspicious of LoC and lynch one. on a quick vote look-over, we have squidyj, scrafty, and mazre. out of the 3, squidyj and scrafty act the scummiest. this isn't taking into account people who were verbally suspicious of him yet didn't vote, which are actually in a higher tier of scumminess because they'd have known LoC was town. i don't have the time to find out who those people were, so for now: VOTE: SquidyjI'm willing to consider this logic for now, given the lack of other information. There's been a recent surge in votes on Terra from people (at time of writing Splinter hasn't updated but it looks like he's at 3), with the main reason being that he's not been playing usefully and he's been somewhat scummy (basically putting him in the same position as Zipped yesterday). Personally, I'm not ready to lynch Terra yet given that he hasn't said anything of note this day. What's your feeling right now on lynching someone from your LoC grouping vs lynching someone outside of it who's acting weird? I've only been at work for about an hour, the rest of that 2.5 hours was getting ready, morning work out, eating, shower, and driving so not much restraint People here post while in traffic all the time. You're slipping #FallFromGrace Posting while in traffic is bad, not only can it lead to a car accident but doing such a thing would have actually lost NX for me! #truestory
Anyway, what are your thoughts on (and feel free to link me to other posts if you've covered any of this already) CzarTim and mine and Corn's logic, Ridli and mine and Crimson's logic, Dusk and his basic parrot of Ridli from yesterday, Nin and Trigger as the two non-voters yesterday and fairly low activity people? You've seemed focused on particular issues and I'm wondering why, specifically on Terra and Xam and now kind of branching towards Squidy but you haven't really commented on the other big pushes from what I recall.
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Post by Cherry Bomb on Jan 12, 2016 9:00:12 GMT -8
Nin still hasn't shown up yet. What an absolute bother. If I were to designate the lot I believe to be most unscrupulous, I would probably say nin, ridli, and Terra. Nin I've already explained partially but when going over his dialogue from yesterday, he struck me as someone willing to coast by without taking a side (a stance characterized by his lack of vote). Ridli is someone who strikes me as being more knowledgeable than he lets on. Whether he's a Talented Mr. Ridli or simply riffraff is yet to be seen, but I do wish to see how he acts under pressure. Terra's last-minute vote swap and general contentedness to follow along with the most popular opinion (e.g. voting for Sorian out of nowhere with inadequate explanation before switching to myself and then zipped in turn) puts a rather disturbing feeling in my tummy, and I'm not sure what could resolve it but more information. I as i said earlier it was the middle of the night the day started. But i am here now , so at least ican respond to your push. I wont take the allegation that i coasted by though. I put down my feelings regarding you and Sorian since they were the only ones that struck out to me. You got some heat for trying to get rid of LoC, and since him getting voted off the island and therefore the volcano errupting i think my vote will fall on your ass. VOTE: scraftydevilI know his vote can be seen as a reaction that you voted on me , but i want to explain that i react to you pushing Loc off the island and causing this mess on the first place  Feel free to respond to this asap. I will be here and will hear you ou aswell. Oh, deary me... This is not a good look for you, luv. Seems as though you just want me out of here and don't really care why, which makes me think I might be onto something. Even if I give you the benefit of the doubt and believe that you're just voting for me because Castamere turned out to be town, the fact remains that he was lying about his role so my suspicion of him was not unwarranted. I'm keeping my vote exactly where it is, luv. |
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Post by Coppanuva on Jan 12, 2016 9:00:59 GMT -8
I'm willing to consider this logic for now, given the lack of other information. There's been a recent surge in votes on Terra from people (at time of writing Splinter hasn't updated but it looks like he's at 3), with the main reason being that he's not been playing usefully and he's been somewhat scummy (basically putting him in the same position as Zipped yesterday). Personally, I'm not ready to lynch Terra yet given that he hasn't said anything of note this day. What's your feeling right now on lynching someone from your LoC grouping vs lynching someone outside of it who's acting weird? People here post while in traffic all the time. You're slipping #FallFromGrace Posting while in traffic is bad, not only can it lead to a car accident but doing such a thing would have actually lost NX for me! #truestory
Anyway, what are your thoughts on (and feel free to link me to other posts if you've covered any of this already) CzarTim and mine and Corn's logic, Ridli and mine and Crimson's logic, Dusk and his basic parrot of Ridli from yesterday, Nin and Trigger as the two non-voters yesterday and fairly low activity people? You've seemed focused on particular issues and I'm wondering why, specifically on Terra and Xam and now kind of branching towards Squidy but you haven't really commented on the other big pushes from what I recall.
Yeah I know it's bad, it was a joke (I'd be pissed if you posted in traffic). Sure thing, I'll go over and provide some opinions on those later. I haven't really had much time to reply to these since I've been trying to catch up on work and have to write my yearly self-review (which is time-sensitive) so I've been kinda preoccupied trying to balance those and catching up to all that happened Day 1 and how it factors in here. I'm almost done with the review though so I should be able to provide some more opinions later today and get caught up a bit more. I'll give opinions on those in a bit once I've had time to look through all the posts and think on them more. |
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Post by cabot on Jan 12, 2016 9:03:23 GMT -8
Question: If we get to lynching point on a player and they pull 'I'm an outsider' defense, are we just going to instantly assume bs?
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Post by Sorian on Jan 12, 2016 9:07:10 GMT -8
Question: If we get to lynching point on a player and they pull 'I'm an outsider' defense, are we just going to instantly assume bs? Personally, I am. I can't imagine there being two of those roles in the game. It already bordered on game breaking the first time imo. |
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Post by CzarTim on Jan 12, 2016 9:07:19 GMT -8
nin, yesterday you stated scrafty and LoC's engagement was fake and now you are just saying it's scrafty? You have nothing to add? For someone who says they feel bad for missing out on so much, you sure are adding nothing.
Vote: nin1000
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Post by ridli on Jan 12, 2016 9:07:30 GMT -8
Question: If we get to lynching point on a player and they pull 'I'm an outsider' defense, are we just going to instantly assume bs? Absolutely. |
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Post by CzarTim on Jan 12, 2016 9:12:42 GMT -8
Actually, wait, I might go ridli today. Reading through him feels a lot like raindoc / flux arrogant newbie scum.
Vote: ridli
Still open for voting nin though.
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Post by Roytheone on Jan 12, 2016 9:13:58 GMT -8
Question: If we get to lynching point on a player and they pull 'I'm an outsider' defense, are we just going to instantly assume bs? I will, yeah. |
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Post by CzarTim on Jan 12, 2016 9:17:24 GMT -8
And yeah, tb / dusk need to post more.
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Post by CzarTim on Jan 12, 2016 9:19:16 GMT -8
To be clear re: rid
I think his reaction to pressure is worse than his speculation yesterday. Not sure if the speculation would have been enough for me.
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Post by xamtheking on Jan 12, 2016 9:19:31 GMT -8
Also, ya'll be harping on my claim from Woof 2, and the only reason I claimed so early is that Ultron did as well. I had enough intelligence to realize that if I kept my claim until I was about to be lynched, a negative percentage of the players would have believed me
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Post by Sorian on Jan 12, 2016 9:21:25 GMT -8
Also, ya'll be harping on my claim from Woof 2, and the only reason I claimed so early is that Ultron did as well. I had enough intelligence to realize that if I kept my claim until I was about to be lynched, a negative percentage of the players would have believed me Woof 2 is in the past, doesn't matter. You did not need to claim here (if you are telling the truth and in all honesty, bad time to lie too). Is there a reason you're defending your decisions instead of reading players? |
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Post by CzarTim on Jan 12, 2016 9:23:01 GMT -8
I'd like to hear nin's thoughts on kawl, ridli, and squid.
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Post by Terrabyte20xx on Jan 12, 2016 9:23:09 GMT -8
I'm re-reading through day 2 so I can get up to speed on what I've missed. I wasn't planning to claim today, the giant fucking volcano pushed me forward Don't buy it. But you're also not really on my radar at the moment regardless. Policy lynch with this little knowledge isn't quite worth it. I hate that move, but not enough to jeopardize success in its stead. That said, I have a question for you and Terra. Both of you were near last minute switches to the vote on Zipped. You, Xam, were on Scrafty before who at the time you switched voting was at 5 votes to 8 (if I'm reading the sheet correctly). Your switch moved it from 4-9, why the last minute switch? Were you less convinced of Scrafty at that point, or did you just want to join the pack?
The same thing goes for you Terra. You switched from Sorian (who had 4 votes at the time, compared to Zipped's 7). You said you did it to avoid a tie, moving it to a 3-8 differential. The point is, neither of the candidates you two had votes on were THAT close to forcing a tie. Why did you feel compelled to join the lump in on Zipped? Because there was a tie when I was typing the post? You know there's both internet and human input lag in these things right? I didn't know that there was going to be a flood while typing until I hit send. |
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Post by cabot on Jan 12, 2016 9:23:32 GMT -8
Also, ya'll be harping on my claim from Woof 2, and the only reason I claimed so early is that Ultron did as well. I had enough intelligence to realize that if I kept my claim until I was about to be lynched, a negative percentage of the players would have believed me And you claimed early here because....? We're at 20, it's not the end of the world yet, nowhere near claim territory unless you're getting lynched. Think about it, if you were NKed as an ordinary, that's nice, because theoretically you were killed over a PR. If you were lynched as an ordinary and claiming just before you died, bummer. It's not the end of the world though. Scum benefit from this, Town don't. |
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Post by Sorian on Jan 12, 2016 9:28:06 GMT -8
I'm re-reading through day 2 so I can get up to speed on what I've missed. Don't buy it. But you're also not really on my radar at the moment regardless. Policy lynch with this little knowledge isn't quite worth it. I hate that move, but not enough to jeopardize success in its stead. That said, I have a question for you and Terra. Both of you were near last minute switches to the vote on Zipped. You, Xam, were on Scrafty before who at the time you switched voting was at 5 votes to 8 (if I'm reading the sheet correctly). Your switch moved it from 4-9, why the last minute switch? Were you less convinced of Scrafty at that point, or did you just want to join the pack?
The same thing goes for you Terra. You switched from Sorian (who had 4 votes at the time, compared to Zipped's 7). You said you did it to avoid a tie, moving it to a 3-8 differential. The point is, neither of the candidates you two had votes on were THAT close to forcing a tie. Why did you feel compelled to join the lump in on Zipped? Because there was a tie when I was typing the post? You know there's both internet and human input lag in these things right? I didn't know that there was going to be a flood while typing until I hit send. Something that has bothered me and this is not a specific defense to Terra but just more for anyone using this logic. The vote record is good and all but the last half hour of day 1 were very shaky. I don't think a lot of us remembered that Splinter was updating a spreadsheet and he was doing his best to get vote counts out but it was hard following along because his counts just had numbers and not who was voting for who so whenever someone switched we weren't sure if they were switching from the frontrunner to someone else which would be a much bigger swing than someone who didn't have an active vote putting one down. I see a lot of people coming down on Terra for switching and saying he wanted to prevent a tie. I was there at time, his switch was not odd for that reason, I wasn't sure if his vote was needed to stop a tie at the time (it seems like it wasn't) but in the moment, there was definitely some confusion. |
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Post by CzarTim on Jan 12, 2016 9:31:24 GMT -8
Yeah, I was going to say I completely loss track of the votes at the end on mobile. This forum is nice and all but I wish we had run the game on gaf proper where we have the vote tool. Only two other games were going at the time so it wouldn't have been spamy.
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Post by xamtheking on Jan 12, 2016 9:31:45 GMT -8
Also, ya'll be harping on my claim from Woof 2, and the only reason I claimed so early is that Ultron did as well. I had enough intelligence to realize that if I kept my claim until I was about to be lynched, a negative percentage of the players would have believed me Woof 2 is in the past, doesn't matter. You did not need to claim here (if you are telling the truth and in all honesty, bad time to lie too). Is there a reason you're defending your decisions instead of reading players? Here are some reads: CzarTim is feeling town to me, but he just really, REALLY doesn't not like Blarg's playstyle I think you, Crimson, Cornb and Mazre are all town I'm on the fence about Scrafty Ridli, Dusk, and Squidy are all acting weird as hell |
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Post by cabot on Jan 12, 2016 9:32:45 GMT -8
Life without a vote machine is annoying.
I'll grant the no tie vote is the least convincing evidence, but the other non-committal stuff is there. Now I initially went after zipped and it led to the volcano exploding so yeah I'm feeling a little more pressure on making a choice this time round.
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